LA PAPESSE

1-The figure of this card also as the first card numbered is looking toward the opposite of the card sequence.
Clearly she is looking to LE BATELEVR because as I see to number a card is to place it related to the others in sequence.So with regard to the sequence.
2-She has behind her a sort of veil or curtain related to her throne.
This veil has curled end on both sides so I ever thought that if one stand by her on a side one can not see her face so also not the others figures of the card sequence.
So what can one only see on that position ?
-Her left hand (the one of the heart) with her big thumb (the finger of Venus ) touching the open book skin coloured ( earth=wisdom of life)
See the size of her left hand.If she open it all surely can cover all the book of life experience with his heart hand...
3-This book is open contrary to her Visconti ancestor where it is closed.
Ours TdM figure show to us openly her wisdom but also she is warning us that be must gain it by experience.
So that is why she is looking toward the left so to the past.
Her right hand is hidden so she is not a woman of outward action.She sum experience she gain wisdom.
Her body is all covered by her clothes one can not see her legs.She did not move before she will not move after.
We see only her face watching around the past the book open and her left hand.
She is static for outside and very on action on her inner side.
4-Noblet show to us two portions of her Mitre even though may be it has three portions as LE PAPE.
May be just for remark the number two of the card and also a subtle message to remind us her supposed lower position with regard to him.


eugim

Oh, my, look at all these topics!
Miguelito is going to be keeping me busy this week!
Yes! Mi gusto!!!

I'll be back Monday when I have time to devote proper attention to these!

-Stella my most beautiful latin baby ...

-Could you just answer to my post two or three words ?

eugim

I think it is going to take more than two or three words! You have been busy here, I see!

Do you think she is having some revelation that has made her stop and look up from her book?

Have you heard or read the theory that there is a spinning wheel at her feet, and that her book might also be a tapestry?

I like what you said about her hand and thumb. I hadn't thought about it like that.

What do you think of the Pope Joan stories?

-Hello Stella and thanks for answer me.

1-I think she is the revelation by herself.
I said that the pages of the book are skin coloured,so is a wisdom gained by experience.

2-I never heard nothing about a spinning wheel at her feet.If you know the deck please tell me.

3-With regard to Popess Joan (Guglielma / Manfreda) here I leave a link of some thoughts I changed with Huck and Ross Cadlwell at Aeclectic.

http://tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=100361

-Well my impression is that Pope Joan really existed but was Italian and for me Tarot de Marseille has another different iconographic source.
She is for me a depiction of the path of the heart instead of the one of reason.
She is the bridge to ours Soul and her book is not for reading,is for live it.
Wisdom by experience in the real world.

eugim

That's beautiful!

I got the spinning wheel idea from jmd's course, he mentions it.

Look at the bottom left of the card, the red rounded part and what looks like a spoke in light blue.



I think there is also something like this in the Payen, or one of the others. I'll have to go back and check. But Jean-Michel mentioned that it's possible that you don't see her right hand because it is poking the needle up from the bottom of the tapestry.

I'm not saying "it's a tapestry and not a book" - it can be seen BOTH ways. That's what makes this the best deck.

I think there's some truth to the Pope Joan story, too, but the "died in childbirth in a Papal procession" story sounds like a 13th century urban legend to me.

1-With a deep respect to JMD I think if Noblet thought that a spinning wheel should be there surely there it was.
2-Precisely Noblet best characteristic is that he is very direct on an iconographic sense.
See he named XIII as Death when nobody done.
Also he has no problem on expose LE MAT genitals in the year of 1650.
Or show to us the naked breast and nipples of the REYNE DE BATON.
3-With regard to Popess Joan it is a fact that after that "incident" so since then all the elected Popes have to prove his "genitals" male attributions.That why the Pope throne has hole just to "touch" his balls. (And be sure these time ... )

eugim

eugim wrote:

1-With a deep respect to JMD I think if Noblet thought that a spinning wheel should be there surely there it was.
2-Precisely Noblet best characteristic is that he is very direct on an iconographic sense.
See he named XIII as Death when nobody done.

Good point!

Quote :

Also he has no problem on expose LE MAT genitals in the year of 1650.

Strange how Conver, etc. covered those up, but left them on the Devil.
With Dodal and Payen, it's hard to tell. Maybe a speedo, lol.

Quote :

3-With regard to Popess Joan it is a fact that after that "incident" so since then all the elected Popes have to prove his "genitals" male attributions.That why the Pope throne has hole just to "touch" his balls. (And be sure these time ... )

The marble chair at St. John Lateran is REAL?

-Hello Stella ...
1-I don t know who was St. John Lateran but I m sure that after the incident of Popess Joan the Church want to be sure at all ...
See that please.

http://www.priestsofdarkness.com/popes.html#f2

http://www.priestsofdarkness.com/h-art/popegrope.jpg


eugim

eugim wrote:

-Hello Stella ...
1-I don t know who was St. John Lateran

I meant the basilica.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basilica_of_St._John_Lateran

Somebody told me there was a red marble chair there, with a hole in it, where prospective popes had to sit.

Maybe not joking, after all.

Quote :

but I m sure that after the incident of Popess Joan the Church want to be sure at all ...
See that please.

http://www.priestsofdarkness.com/popes.html#f2

http://www.priestsofdarkness.com/h-art/popegrope.jpg

WINNER!

-Excelent post Stella and thanks for the data ...

1-All point to Popess Joan as one existed.
2-As a result the Pope must be " check "
3-Roman Church always left questions without answers...

eugim

eugim wrote:

-Excelent post Stella and thanks for the data ...

1-All point to Popess Joan as one existed.
2-As a result the Pope must be " check "
3-Roman Church always left questions without answers...

eugim

I JUST SAVED A FUCKLOAD OF MONEY ON MY CAR INSURANCE!
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